Factual note · Source-linked

The bit after the figure eight.

Backups, stoppers and Yosemite finishes are not interchangeable terms.

First: which knot are we talking about?

A double overhand can be a stopper at the end of a rope, or form part of a backup arrangement around another strand. Those are different applications. A tail backup does not repair an incomplete tie-in.

Animated Knots by Grog: Double overhand stopper · Petzl: Partner check

A Yosemite finish is a finish, not a second tie-in.

Here, we mean a Yosemite finish on a figure-eight follow-through, not a Yosemite bowline. American Alpine Institute discusses several finish configurations and their limitations. The exact configuration matters; the name alone is not enough.

Why the ring-loading discussion exists

Loading the eye apart is not the same as normally loading the tie-in. American Alpine Institute warns that a classic Yosemite-finished figure eight can invert and fail if the tie-in loop is incorrectly used to attach a belay device when catching a fall. Its article distinguishes that misuse from the intended setup. This is not evidence that every knot called a Yosemite finish will fail under normal tie-in loading.

American Alpine Institute: Yosemite finish: a refinement to the figure eight

What should you use at your wall?

Ask a qualified instructor to demonstrate and check the exact tie-in and finish required by your wall and equipment guidance. Keep the manufacturer's instructions and your partner check separate from anyone's aesthetic preferences. This page deliberately gives no tying sequence, improvised test or universal tail-length rule.

Petzl · Diagrams + videoTying in with a figure 8 knot Manufacturer guidance, diagrams and the accompanying tying-in video.Petzl · Checks before climbingPartner check A mutual check of the belay system, harness, tie-in and rope before climbing.American Alpine Institute · Variant-specific discussionYosemite finish: a refinement to the figure eight A discussion of the finish and its failure risk when the tie-in loop is incorrectly used for belaying.

The discussion is over here.

The lads have not reached a consensus on lunch, let alone terminology.

Yosemite finish. Again.

Sources checked 6 October 2026. This is an orientation to the linked guidance, not climbing instruction.